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| What if... |
Posted: Mon Mar 24, 2003 11:39 pm Post subject: 1 |
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| I just thought I'd point out that in the coin puzzle, the "manufacturing" is all stated in the problem, but the solution does not depend on such unusual circumstances. |
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| Sofis |
Posted: Mon Feb 24, 2003 2:26 pm Post subject: 0 |
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Originally posted by ZutAlors!: Well, realistically, Sofis, the coefficient of thermal expansion for different materials doesn't range widely.
But then, presumably, no material would do. I know this to not be true. The inspiration for this puzzle was a school physics lab from some time ago, which involved seeing a metal ball fit through a hole, heating it, and seeing it no longer fit through. While the heating involved a bunsen burner, by the time the ball had cooled down sufficiently to fit through the hole again, if I recall correctly, it was possible to touch it without getting burned. While this would indeed require some pretty specific manufacturing, this sometimes happens in puzzles. (Oh, and if the urinal being ceramic is a problem (since you keep mentioning it - FWIW, the urinal in my head was metal), I would assume that the drain hole itself had some sort of metal girding it. At least, I've never seen a drain that was simply a hole bored into ceramic.)
Originally posted by Vagrant: How exactly do we get enough hot water on the door to make it expand to a tight fit?
Simply starting to flood the room would get water onto the door. |
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| Usurper |
Posted: Mon Feb 24, 2003 12:13 pm Post subject: -1 |
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| What people don't seem to realise is that If Sofis can change the material of which marbels are made, willy-nilly, he can no doubt change the laws of physics pretty easily, thus the whole stupid idea of letting the marbles expand whilst in a porous shirt, is in fact not stupid at all and based on sound scientific reasoning. All we need to do is use the new Sophysics, or is it spelt Sofisics? |
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| Beartalon |
Posted: Fri Feb 21, 2003 6:43 am Post subject: -2 |
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| The puzzle said the marbles just fit through those holes. Whether or not they expanded, if they were held in place by the cloth, even if it is porous, would they not have blocked the water? |
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| Vagrant |
Posted: Thu Feb 20, 2003 8:55 pm Post subject: -3 |
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| How exactly do we get enough hot water on the door to make it expand to a tight fit? |
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| ZutAlors! |
Posted: Thu Feb 20, 2003 2:10 pm Post subject: -4 |
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| Well, realistically, Sofis, the coefficient of thermal expansion for different materials doesn't range widely. Here's a table, f'rinstance. Glass and ceramics, the first materials I think of when thinking "marbles", lie on the lower end, in the 5E-6/F range. Steel is roughly only double that, and the most expansive materials are only around 20E-6/F. That would still only give an expansion of about 0.001 inches (25 microns) or so, well below what I would think a normal manufacturing tolerance for ceramic urinal holes. Seems like the expansion would be possible if there were only one hole, but seems highly unlikely, still, that all holes (and marbles!) are so similar. |
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| Sofis |
Posted: Thu Feb 20, 2003 1:45 pm Post subject: -5 |
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| HappyFunBall, your objection assumes that the marbles are made of glass. The material of the marbles is not stated in the puzzle. |
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| HappyFunBall |
Posted: Thu Feb 20, 2003 4:50 am Post subject: -6 |
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It's really sad that whoever wrote this puzzle relied on a solution requiring some knowledge of physics, yet clearly was clueless about the physics himself. See previous posts by ZutAlors and myself for more detail.
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| Beartalon |
Posted: Wed Feb 19, 2003 5:04 pm Post subject: -7 |
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| Regardless of how you accomplished it, increasing the size of the marbles worked. |
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| Chamera |
Posted: Wed Feb 19, 2003 11:41 am Post subject: -8 |
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| What about wrapping the marbles in your clothing, increasing their size without leaking 'too' much, or loosing them down the drain. |
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| Beartalon |
Posted: Wed Feb 19, 2003 4:09 am Post subject: -9 |
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| The solution is posted via the puzzle link in the first post of this thread |
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| Squirrel |
Posted: Wed Feb 19, 2003 3:43 am Post subject: -10 |
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| I think the ring stays the same. |
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| rosebud1o1 |
Posted: Mon Feb 17, 2003 9:28 pm Post subject: -11 |
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take this serious.... you have a list of solutions use thoes and be serious!!! ======================================== som one... please make some sence |
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| Lady Phoenix |
Posted: Mon Feb 17, 2003 8:50 pm Post subject: -12 |
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| I don't know if that is what Eidilon Romskell meant, but why not just poop in the urinal and block the drain with it?You could maybe reenforce the block with clothing, marbles, etc... |
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| Lady Phoenix |
Posted: Mon Feb 17, 2003 8:45 pm Post subject: -13 |
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Um, I'm new here and I don't have much experience with this kind of puzzle, but it seems to me that you guys are making this a little more complex than it needs to be. What's to stop you from wrapping each of your marbles in part of your hat and simply placing them in the holes? It seems that one of two things would happen. Either your hat isn't porous ("your /clothes/ are far too porous to serve as blockage" and "you have your /clothes/, your /Sherlock Holmes hat/." Your hat is listed separately from your clothes), or your hat /is/ porous and it will take slightly longer to fill the cabin with water. After all, even if some water leaks through, there is still more water that enters the room then exits it. This assumes that you don't drown and that the cabin is watertight. Oh well, at least it's better than starving to death.
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| Eidilon Romskell |
Posted: Mon Feb 17, 2003 9:44 am Post subject: -14 |
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| Just take a crap in the stall! Geez!! |
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| suds |
Posted: Mon Feb 17, 2003 5:53 am Post subject: -15 |
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if you put the shirt into the drain, and then the marbles on the shirt, would that seal the drain? because then you would have the marbles jammed into the holes pretty tightly... just a guess
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| Totem |
Posted: Sun Feb 16, 2003 11:07 pm Post subject: -16 |
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Preheat the marbles with a magnifing glass and then drop them down your pants. After that you will: 1.Scream loud enough to be heard and rescued. 2.Possibly jump high enough to reach the window. (sorry couldnt resist)
all ideas look good but I wonder if sunrays filtered through a armoured glass will make magnifing glass work well enough. ps. or when you open the window you can write the message on dogs collar(burning letters with m.glass for ex.) and throw the dog out
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| Eca |
Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2003 6:35 pm Post subject: -17 |
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| another thought that struck me was to get the water out of the urinal by perhaps breaking the pipe where the water is flowing in and then if it is copper piping(wich is what most piping is today unless its pvc) then we can simply bend it so it is hitting one of the wooden wall and wait untill it erodes it enough so you can break through. if it takes too long thatn spot will be sufficent supply of food until it erodes enough. im not sure exactly how we can get the water out if the pipes are not copper but still the general idea stays the same. hit the wall with water and it will erode. |
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| HappyFunBall |
Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2003 5:48 am Post subject: -18 |
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If the intended solution to this problem relies on the thermal expansion of the marbles, then it's truly an extremely poor problem. As ZutAlors correctly pointed out, glass' coefficient of thermal expansion is around 9x10^-6. Glass is going to melt before the expansion becomes significant. Plus, even if the expansion were just enough to allow the marbles to block the drain, the water filling the room, and the marbles, would cool back down, reopening the drain.
So, if you want to use clothing or the hat to help seal the drain also, you still have to assume that the pourousness isn't too high for it to still be a factor. Don't forget also, that once the room floods higher than the water is coming out, the pressure of the water above the pipe letting it in is going to slow, then eventually stop the flow, as equilibrium is reached. A slowing flow of water will also make partial seals with clothing less effective. How much it slows, and how high it will reach before stopping depend upon the pressure in the pipe taking water into the room, the height of the pipe bringing water in, and the cross sectional area of the drain and the pipe.
None of this information is given, so any answer that relies on flooding is totally unsatisfactory.
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| Mark |
Posted: Fri Feb 14, 2003 8:49 pm Post subject: -19 |
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If we can presume that the window does get sunlight then by attatching the bag of marbles (wet) to a rope made of clothing you could hook onto the handle and open the window- if the handle is big enough.
Then using the magnifying glass and some sunlight you could set fire to some other clothing and then (now naked) throw the burning bundle out of the opened window hopefully causing a forest fire that will attract attention and allow you to be rescued.
Or you could stand on the dog- hopefully it's a big dog, to give you a better jump at the window.
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| Mr_Delusive |
Posted: Fri Feb 14, 2003 12:29 pm Post subject: -20 |
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No I know the answer... you rip the toilet out, with your clothes and use the hat on the dog, then you place the toilet under the window, take the hat off the dog, get your marbles out, (Oh and what is a handle in the middle of the glass) and open the window with the handle, then squeeze out and get the dog and run off to the nearest petrol station to have somthing to eat. Thats the answer ahahaha. it is very logical and its what a person would do, so yes. OR if your feeling like your busting to go to the toilet, you can go. or maybe you can use that to your advantage YES. you could use some of the dogs hair to make a toiletblocker. EVEN BETTER, you can use the dog to clog up the toilet and then it can fill up with water ad you can get out.. Thanks for reading my answers.
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| Usurper |
Posted: Fri Feb 14, 2003 12:27 pm Post subject: -21 |
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| Second hardest, Mac, after your head. |
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| Mr_Delusive |
Posted: Fri Feb 14, 2003 12:19 pm Post subject: -22 |
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I say just keep chucking marbles at the window. Wasnt there a handle on the window as well?? you could pull it off and stick it down the toilet and wrap your shirt around it. then you can use the hot water on the glass to break it. ahh. I say that is the most best way.
The other way is to use the window, magnifying glass and a bit of water to magnify the sun so much it burns the WOODEN door. yes thats it |
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| Mac |
Posted: Thu Feb 13, 2003 9:23 pm Post subject: -23 |
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| If the people are diamond theives maybe there is a bag of diamonds which can then be used to block the holes. If that doesn't work then make a diamond axe and chop the door down since diamond is the hardest naturally occuring substance |
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| Beartalon |
Posted: Thu Feb 13, 2003 5:14 am Post subject: -24 |
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I'll believe that when Sofis tells me I'm right (or most likely not) |
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| rosebud1o1 |
Posted: Thu Feb 13, 2003 2:07 am Post subject: -25 |
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| your too smart Beartalon!!!!!! |
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| Beartalon |
Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2003 5:31 pm Post subject: -26 |
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...You can tell the door is barred by listening to them throw the locks in place...
There is more than one drainage hole. If I take a piece of clothing and drop a marble into it, I can stuff it into one drainage hole. The cloth would hold the marble in place, blocking that hole. If I then put more marbles into the same cloth and block other holes, the marbles would stop the water flow, and the cloth would be tensioned in place with the marbles and the downward water pressure. The water's heat would expand the marbles somewhat, making the blockage more efficient, possibly breaking the pipes and flooding the room more quickly. The urinal would probably only require one garment.
The crack under the door can still be fixed somewhat with clothes. Yes, they are porous, but when cloth gets wet, the water molecules form tension between the fibres, and it expands (like excess water will bulge around the rim of a glass before it finally spills).
The hat is simply another piece of clothing and may have no purpose. Maybe the magnifying glass is as well. Assuming the gap under the door is not as tall as the hat, the hat can be placed with one if it's bills wedged under the door, then the rest of your clothing laid so it overlaps the hat. The bill will keep the hat in place, and the clothing will push out around the hat under the door, but not flow into the next room because the hat holds it back.
The magnifying glass and the dog? I don't know. If you get hungry, use sunlight to cook the dog using the magnifying glass? 
The other problem here is how long can you wait in almost painfully hot water to float you to the top?
[This message has been edited by Beartalon (edited 02-11-2003 12:32 PM).] |
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| Max |
Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2003 4:23 pm Post subject: -27 |
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| or maybe you can just unlock the door... |
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| Max |
Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2003 4:21 pm Post subject: -28 |
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if you can divert the water so the drain holes get cooler they will get smaller, then putting the marbles in them will work...
then by the time the diverted water gets back to the drain it will not be so hot, so they won't expand...
but is the room water tight? If it is that might work. |
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| robichelli |
Posted: Sun Feb 09, 2003 1:18 am Post subject: -29 |
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| Considering that half the people posting in this thread aren't even registered, you really can't trust them too much to accept all ideas. Besides, half the posts I write are never acknowledged by anyone, but I still post. |
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| rosebud1o1 |
Posted: Sat Feb 08, 2003 2:56 pm Post subject: -30 |
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look at # 97........ use the hat in some way shape or form... if its that specific it must be important........ __________________________________________________________________ dont people ever listen |
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| woody |
Posted: Fri Feb 07, 2003 11:01 pm Post subject: -31 |
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alright alright we may have the solution already said but if the window is just out of reach then it must be about 8 1/2 to 9 feet up. stand on the urinal which is about 2 feet off the ground and jump to the window. open the window and climb out the window. open the door, rescue spot, bob's your uncle and you and spot are safe.  |
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| 2wicefyre |
Posted: Thu Feb 06, 2003 5:13 am Post subject: -32 |
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| how about using the magnifying glass to focus sunlight through the window and then burning the cabin down... |
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| sporter |
Posted: Wed Feb 05, 2003 9:11 pm Post subject: -33 |
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| If the hot water is already running - then the porcelain has already expanded as much as it's going to. |
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| rosebud1o1 |
Posted: Tue Feb 04, 2003 11:34 pm Post subject: -34 |
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| the puzzle specifies that you have a "shurlock-holms hat"...... dont they have buckles on the front? i mean you can use that to pry the hinges of the bared door thus leading you to the rest of the unlocked cabin and you and your dog free!.............. |
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| By Stander |
Posted: Tue Feb 04, 2003 9:14 am Post subject: -35 |
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| Has anyone here seen Shang hai noon if there are any bars you could bend them like jaki chan did but use the hot water!!! so the clothes would not break when being twisted!!! |
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| skrew2012 |
Posted: Mon Feb 03, 2003 6:54 am Post subject: -36 |
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| two OBVIOUS exits. maybe theres another way out, like into the sewers beneath the room. |
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| MatthewV |
Posted: Sun Feb 02, 2003 10:42 pm Post subject: -37 |
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I think this puzzle has degraded into nothing. That is pitiful.
I believe the idea of the puzzle is to flood the place and then escappe via the window. I believe we have already said that. |
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| quicky |
Posted: Sat Feb 01, 2003 3:21 am Post subject: -38 |
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| to get out you could take the door of the hinges or if there are floorboards remove a couple and try & break the door down or have spot dig a hole to the outside and crawl out... |
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