Gibson Guitars

[Pablo]

This is what you get for creating jobs in the U.S.

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All religions are the same - Guilt....just with different holidays.

[JDTAY]

tl;dw

I'm pretty sure I'm with you on this one though.
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Prohibit nothing. Disclose everything.

[JDTAY]

Though I'm wondering, who wants wooden guitars anyway? This is 2011.

Interesting bit from the web, this wood wasn't banned until 2008, but...:
"Others in the guitar world aren't so upbeat. Attorney Ronald Bienstock says the Gibson raids have aroused the guitar builders he represents because the Lacey Act is retroactive. He says they're worried they might be forced to prove the provenance of wood they acquired decades ago."

Isn't there something in the Constitution about laws like that? "Ex post facto" or somesuch?
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Prohibit nothing. Disclose everything.

[Pablo]

Constitution?

[Zag]

Hi Pablo! Welcome back. Where've you been?

[Pablo]

Just chillin' here in Fargo. I was abducted by aliens.

But I will be moving back to Washington, just across the river from Portland, at the end of the year and retiring there. My wife and dog are already there and I've been spending one week per month there. We already bought a house in Washington, and I'm in an apartment here for the time.
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All religions are the same - Guilt....just with different holidays.

[Zag]

[Pablo]

[Death Mage]

This is the part that always confuses me.

Wood is the very definition of a renewable resource. It literally grows on trees. The more wood we use, the more lumber companies plant trees, so that they can harvest them later, for *gasp* more wood.

WHY the hell are we not trying to encourage as much wood use as possible? Why are so many environmentalists doing the exact opposite, throwing a hissy fit whenever someone uses something that came from a tree? It makes no damn sense.
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* These senseless ramblings brought to you by Insanity™. If you just can't figure the dang thing out, it must be Insanity™.
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[Pablo]

Here's a thought, DM:

[Thok*]

[Zag]

Are you seriously going to take the dogmatic, head-in-the-sand position that government should not have ANY power to regulate how wood is harvested. I've seen the "forests" in New Hampshire that were clear cut over a century ago. They are ruined and it will be a millennium before they recover, if ever. THAT is what you get if you just let the free market dictate what will happen, when the people making the decisions care only about profit and not about the rape of the land which affects not only the land they own but the land around it for miles.

So, let's agree that there should be some regulation. Was THIS regulation appropriate? It sounds like it was not. Furthermore, it sounds as if the application of it was stupid and overly aggressive.

My point is that you can point to a law that might be bad, and an application of it that clearly was, and say "See! Government regulation bad!"

I'll point to the ruined forests in New Hampshire and Maine and say, "See! Complete lack of government regulation bad!"

The answer is to have good regulation, that prevents the horrible rape of the land that used to happen, but allows for responsible companies to operate profitably. I agree this isn't it. Just don't forget what this was supposed to fix.

[extropalopakettle]

[Zag]

If you want to pretend you're making it clearer, you have to hide the URL. redstate.com is hardly a "fair and balanced" news source. It's basically just an open blog, not even trying to claim journalistic integrity.

[extropalopakettle]

[Zag]

Ahh. I didn't notice the audio clip. That is definitely relevant.

[itisally]

Only because trees and loggers are near and dear to my heart, I feel the need to input here that most of the loggers that I have met also oppose clear cutting for harvesting trees.

In an ideal world we could trust companies to do what is right for long term growth and have a sense of social/global obligation. But too many examples are available to show that we can't do that. Unfortunately we also have plenty examples of governmental knee jerk reactions that are equally unbalanced, used to appease the opinions of people who lack a comprehensive understanding of the situation.
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I could agree with you, but then we would both be wrong.

[Pablo]

For what it's worth, this thread was not intended to be about natural resources. It was intended to be about corrupt government and its abusive behavior toward its subjects citizens.
_________________
All religions are the same - Guilt....just with different holidays.

[Death Mage]

But natural resources, and the discussion thereof, is just another thing the oppressive and corrupt government can latch onto.
_________________
* These senseless ramblings brought to you by Insanity™. If you just can't figure the dang thing out, it must be Insanity™.
[YOUR AD HERE!]

[itisally*]

I guess my concern then is that big government and big corporations can both be oppresive. I don't think that either have long term good of the whole at the forefront of thier disiccion making proccess. Most models of government work well on smaller scales but fall apart when you don't have to look the people you are dealing with in the eye. Business is no diffrent.

[Thok*]

[Dread Pirate Westley]

[Scurra]

Where are the thumbs-up buttons when you need them? Thanks Thok and DPW - I needed those laughs.
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_{still Quiz Olympiad champion. Must get a life.
New definitions: COFFEE - someone who is coughed upon}

[extropalopakettle]

[Pablo]

_________________
All religions are the same - Guilt....just with different holidays.