Heroes Mafia Mini: Day 3 dawns, town wins!

[Sefer]

The deadline will be 12 PM Pacific (3 PM Eastern). It's safe to assume that any deadline I set will be at noon unless I specify otherwise.

Edited to add the current vote count to the top of the page, edited again because I missed lexprod's unvote:
Vote Count:

lexprod (2): Amb, MNOWAX
Amb (1): Undercover Monk
MNOWAX (1): theopholis

Not Voting: Projectyl, Courk, CrashTextDummie, Livingod, CzarJ, lexprod

With 10 alive, it takes 6 to lynch.
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[lexprod]

Mod, I unvoted at the bottom of page 9
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I'll have a P please...

[MNOWAX]

[Undercover Monk]

And now with that helpful deadline extension here is my amazing excellent case against Amb the relatively scummy!

A list of the bandwagons of this game in the order they appeared:
Amb
CrashTextDummy
Livingod
Poisonium
Lexprod

How Amb Voted
Amb posts the first vote against me for not showing up on time.
Amb follows CTD bandwagon with 4 ^th vote.
Amb creates Livingod bandwagon with 3 ^rd vote.
Amb follows Poisonium bandwagon with 6 ^th vote
Amb 2 ^nd vote on Lexprod after a failed attempt to bandwagon me again!

you accused me of just following the crowd Amb and yet that seems to be exactly what you are doing.

Confirm Vote: Amb
_________________
The Classic Blunders:
1. never get involved in a land war in Asia
2.Never go in against a Sicilian when DEATH is on the line
3. Never release Peyton Manning

[Undercover Monk]

Forgot to Add:

The only original thing you seem to do is vote for me, the only player who is consistently calling for votes against you. Sounds more like survival than actually hunting for scum.
_________________
The Classic Blunders:
1. never get involved in a land war in Asia
2.Never go in against a Sicilian when DEATH is on the line
3. Never release Peyton Manning

[Amb]

[theopholis]

[Amb]

Fair enough. Im just grumpy that Im managing to do well in this game and yet be maligned for it. (That said one of the scum I think I have exposed is the one maligning me, so I should really bear that in mind).

[Undercover Monk]

[Sefer]

I'm starting to regret the extension. Deadline is in about 26.5 hours; now is not the time for everyone to stop posting.
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[Courk]

Vote: Amb

[Courk]

Reasoning: Him asking if I had an alternate win condition and how common it was doesn't quite sit right with me. It seems a bit like he could be trying to formulate his own claim.

[lexprod]

UM's arguments using purely bandwagon numbers seems cheap to me as they have no real context. What if he was first all the time? We'd say he's always changing his mind and trying to start bandwagons.

Still, Amb's my main suspect again. I don't really think you should vote for a town, even with an alternate win, as they are town! I mean the scum are going to try to abduct Sylar now anyways, to stop me as well. I'm going to play and have been playing as if I have no alt win condition, because as soon as we'd find a Sylar, no one will let us lynch him.

What I'm trying to explain is that keeping more townies alive is good, no matter how much you don't like their win conditions, unless they directly opposed the town. Mine does not.

Vote: Amb
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I'll have a P please...

[Amb]

No, it means I dont have an alternate win condition, and I suspect anyone who claims to. Especially as shown by Lexprod that they initially lie about it.

[MNOWAX]

oooohh i smell wagon! anyone wanna wagon?

Unvote, Vote: Amb

Seriously, Alternate win conditions are bad. Either you're scum, or you picked a bad time to claim.
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The Man The Myth The Legend
MNOWAX

[Undercover Monk]

I'm not saying following a bandwagon makes you scum. It just seems like Amb's just following the crowd and not really contributing. He just seems to want to take out whoever is closest to being lynched.

Also I don't see how Audrey capturing Syler would be a bad thing for the town. He is definately the biggest threat through the entire season. how does that not help. Lexprod never said town couldn't win he would just win first and if he's town how is that a bad thing. Of course he could be lying..hmmm......

Aww..whatever! Vote Amb everyone!!!!!
_________________
The Classic Blunders:
1. never get involved in a land war in Asia
2.Never go in against a Sicilian when DEATH is on the line
3. Never release Peyton Manning

[lexprod]

[Amb]

[Courk]

[lexprod]

[theopholis]

[CzarJ]

I don't find Amb's statement particularly scummy. I've had a bad feeling about him since the beginning of the game, but I don't think he's the best lynch. With as much as he's posting, he's gonna give us something a lot more damning than that little quip. It sounds to me like someone expressing surprise over two alternate win conditions in such a small game. I don't have one, so I'm a little surprised. As a matter of fact, I think it's more likely that one or the other is lying. Or both, but that's not very likely, because that seems to imply they're both scum, with Courk protecting lexprod, and that's a dangerous game to be playing. Since there's not any real chance of lynching Courk (not that I think we should), and I think lexprod is more suspicious than Amb, even though it's not a slam dunk like Poisonium (or Iraq) was (it rarely is), I'm going to go ahead and Vote: lexprod.

[Amb]

[Courk]

[lexprod]

I think I finally figured Amb out, which is scary.

Amb pinned me as scum and so put me at -2

Then he said I sounded too simple for a game like this and my character.

Then I added the mysterious 2ndary objective, looking like an improvising scum.


Yay, sharing is caring.

Please try to look at it my way as well amb. If you had my role, what would you have done? Pretend that I'm right for a second.

Anyone knows what happens with a tie vote?
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I'll have a P please...

[lexprod]

Nevermind, read the 1st post again
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I'll have a P please...

[CzarJ]

Doing a quick recount of the votes, it looks like my gesture isn't likely to do much.

If Amb is guilty: my bad.

If Amb is innocent: FOS anyone who is lurking and not voting right now.

[MNOWAX]

[Sefer]

Vote Count:

Amb (4): Undercover Monk, Courk, lexprod, MNOWAX
lexprod (2): Amb, CzarJ
MNOWAX (1): theopholis

Not Voting: Projectyl, CrashTextDummie, Livingod

With 10 alive, it takes 6 to lynch.

If you don't like how things are going, you have just over 5 hours to change them.
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[Sefer]

The town spends most of the day staring at each other and not talking. There are occasional bursts of discussion, though, and while they don't reach a majority by sunset, more people think Amb is scum than anyone else. It takes a few tries to lynch him because whoever is about to stick the noose around his neck mysteriously forgets what he was doing, but you finally manage it. Afterwards, you are certain that Amb was the Haitian, roleblocker of the PrimaTech Mafia. He could either target a town member to stop his abilities from functioning or target fellow scum to protect him from the abilities of others.
The town members are elated at there continued success and either head back to their homes or prepare to go about their business for the night.

Amb, the Haitian, Roleblocker of the PrimaTech Mafia, is lynched day two.

Night has fallen and will last for 72 hours, or until I have choices from everyone with a night action (whichever comes sooner). If you fail to get a choice to me tonight you will not act.
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[Sefer]

(The night is ending early even though not all of you have gotten your night actions to me. This is because the remaining night actions can no longer affect the game).

The town gathers in the morning and discovers two of their members, CrashTextDummie and Livingod, are missing.
They head to CrashTextDummie's house first and once again fail to find a body. An examination of his belongings lets them determine that he was, indeed, Matt Parkman, who used his mind reading powers to determine the alignment of one player each night with complete accuracy. Alas, it did not look like he'd be helping them anymore.
In Livingod's house, they are greeted with a grisly sight. He's been nailed to the ceiling using forks and has bled to death. An examination of his computer, conviniently left on, however, brings much joy to the town; he was HRG, and his files indicate that he was the last of the PrimaTech mafia. He must have known somehow that PrimaTech was not going after his daughter, Claire, so that he could safely claim to be her.
Further examination of the computer and the body lead to directions to and keys for a holding facility; most of the town head off to free Cephrir and CrashTextDummie and celebrate their victory. Lexprod, Agent Audrey Hanson, however, realizes that two more have gone missing since it was discovered that PrimaTech was gone; she slips off to investigate Courk and Projectyl on her own.
Courk's belongings reveals that she was actually a he; Claude, the invisible man. He just wanted to survive without being taken by the company; with PrimaTech gone, he's safe, for now. Lexprod rushes to Projectyl's house.
There, she finds what she feared; Projectyl was Sylar all along, and with the elimination of the company that was trying to capture him, he's slipped away as well. She finds a receipt to a bus ticket to New York, however; she's failed here, but she may have another chance.

CrashTextDummie, Matt Parkman, cop; theopholis, Nathan Petrelli, townie; Cephrir, Ted Sprague, townie; Undercover Monk, Isaac Mendez, townie; MNOWAX, Molly Walker, townie; and Czarj, Mohinder Suresh, townie, the members of the town, win.

Courk, Claude, Survivor, wins.

Projectyl, Sylar, who can be described either as a town aligned serial killer or a miller vigalante survivor, wins.

Poisonium, Thompson, Godfather; Amb, the Haitian, roleblocker; and Livingod, HRG, goon with a safe claim, lose.

lexprod, Audrey Hanson, Sylar hunter, loses.

Congratulations winners! Better luck next time, scum and Sylar hunter!


PMs, night actions, and a little analysis to follow.
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[Sefer]

Role PMs:

11. Livingod
You’re HRG, the mysterious man with the Horn Rimmed Glasses. You’re a goon in the PrimaTech mafia. The Haitian (Amb) is your mafia roleblocker and Thompson (Sniklac16) is your mafia Godfather. You’re protecting your daughter, Claire Bennet, and are certain PrimaTech does not know of her abilities; thus, you can be certain that no one has her as a role in this game. You win when all non-Primatech players have been eliminated or nothing can prevent this from happening.

2. Amb
You’re the Haitian. You’re a roleblocker in the PrimaTech mafia. HRG (Livingod) is your fellow goon and Thompson (Sniklac16) is your Godfather. Each night, you’re able to target a player and prevent them from using any powers for the night. Alternately, you may target yourself or one of your allies and make him investigation and night kill immune for the night. If you make the kill for the night you may not use either of these abilities. Someone whose abilities do not work because of your powers will be informed that something prevented their powers from working. You win when all non-Primatech players have been eliminated or nothing can prevent this from happening.
(Mod note: Roleblocking will work on Claude)

9. Sniklac16
You’re Thompson, Godfather of the PrimaTech mafia. HRG (Livingod) is your mafia goon and the Haitian (Amb) is your mafia Roleblocker. You choose who will be abducted each night and who among your mafia will carry out the abduction. The Haitian may only use his special abilities if he is not carrying out the abduction.

8. lexprod
You’re Audrey Hanson, an FBI agent seeking to eliminate Sylar. As such, you win if Sylar is lynched. If Sylar is abducted, your win condition changes to the townie win condition, as you must eliminate the abductors to get at Sylar.

Mod note: detects as innocent regardless of whether she’s gained the townie win condition.

10. CrashTextDummie
You’re Matt Parkman. You’re a cop, able to target a player with your mind reading abilities each night to determine if that player is innocent or guilty. You are guaranteed sane. You win when the abductors have been eliminated.

1. Projectyl
You’re Sylar. Each night you may target a player to kill them. If that player had an ability, you gain it, and on future nights may choose either to kill or to use the ability you gained. You win when the abductors have been eliminated, but only if you survive til the end of the game; this means you can share a win with the town. Good luck convincing the town of that, as you’re also a miller and will detect as guilty if you’re investigated.

Mod Note: in the event that Sylar and mafia target the same player for elimination, Sylar’s kill/power steal takes precedence.

6. theopholis
You’re Nathan Petrelli. You can fly, but that’s not going to do you a lot of good in this game. You’re a vanilla townie. You win when the abductors have been eliminated.

3. Cephrir
You’re Ted Sprague, and you’re radioactive. You don’t have control over it and don’t want to accidentally blow up the whole town, so that’s not going to do you a lot of good in this game. You’re a vanilla townie. You win when the abductors have been eliminated.

12. Undercover Monk
You’re Isaac Mendez. You can paint the future, but only when you’re high, so that’s not going to do you a lot of good in this game. You’re a vanilla townie. You win when the abductors have been eliminated.

5. now a ranger
You’re Molly Walker. You can find people, but you don’t know who to look for, so it’s not going to you a lot of good in this game. You’re a vanilla townie. You win when the abductors have been eliminated.

4. CzarJ
You’re Mohinder Suresh. The abductors want your father’s research and you suspect that they may have been involved in his death. You’re a vanilla townie. You win when the abductors have been eliminated.

7. Courk
You’re Claude. You’re a Survivor, but you’re helped by the fact that you can turn invisible. Each night, you may choose to turn invisible and hide with somebody; some abilities that would target you will instead target the person you hide with. This can not, alas, be used to cause someone to target themselves or someone they can communicate with at night; in this case the ability will fail. You win when the abductors have been eliminated, but only if you survive til the end of the game; this means you can share a victory with the town.

Mod note: dectects as innocent; the Haitian can target him at night, canceling his invisibility and making him vunerable to other night abilities.
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[Sefer]

Night 1:
Projectyl tries to kill Livingod (blocked by Amb)
CrashTextDummie investigates CzarJ (Innocent)
Amb protects Livingod (invest/kill immune) (Stops Projectyl’s kill)
Livingod abducts Cephrir (Successful abduction)
Courk hides with Amb (no effect)

Night 2:
Livingod abducts CrashTextDummie
Projectyl kills Livingod
(I didn't wait for any other kills)
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[CzarJ]

Wow. We rock.

And I can take solace in the fact that while I was wrong about Amb, I was right about Livingod. Ya jerks.

[Sefer]

(I like to analyze games, so this will be long. I won't be insulted if you skip this post)
First off, I'd like to clarify that lexprod achieving his win condition by lynching Sylar would not have ended the game; lexprod would have left a winner and the rest of you would have continued. My general philosphy on alternate win conditions is that the game does not end until every win condition is either eliminated or impossible to achieve, but anyone who has achieved their win condition will leave the game.

You may have noticed that there were, indeed, several alternate win conditons: Sylar, Hanson, and Claude (meaning that a third of the "town" actually had some other requirment to win). Hanson was the only one who could die and still achieve her win condition (and was the only one that didn't need the town to win to win herself), but all were set up to be able to share a win with the town. Sylar and Hanson, however, could not both win, since Sylar had to survive and Hanson had to insure he didn't. I set it up that way in the hope that two town players who needed different things might add an interesting twist to the game, but I don't think it ended up affecting it much; in retrospect it might have been a good idea to tell Hanson who Sylar was and/or let Sylar know someone was hunting him. I actually considered the first part, but I didn't see any way to do so without Hanson outing Sylar and therefore not giving him much of a chance.

I also gave those roles an easier time than the traditional Lyncher, Survivor, and Serial Killer. Hanson didn't lose if her target was abducted, changing to a vanilla townie at that point. Sylar could pick up extra powers (though he never did) and didn't need to eliminate the town in addition to the mafia. Claude had a powerful ability that translated to near night kill immunity (being targeted by the Haitian being the only thing that would stop it), so the only way for him to lose would be to be lynched. I always felt that those roles were a bit on the underpowered side, since it was much easier for them to lose than anyone on a team; hence the boost.

I didn't give powers to several town members that, thematically, could have had powers because I had a hard time figuring out a balanced way to do so in such a small setup. As it was, just having a vigilante and cop on the town's side was more than enough (with only the vigilante kill actually having an effect). I actually expected Sylar's kills to target town some of the time, but this town did an excellent job of outing scum so that he had a scum target. This was pretty much the optimal play for town (winning by day 3), but if the town had mislynched and Sylar had mistargeted, scum could have won in the same time frame (with six dead by day 3 the would either have won immediately or had it more or less in the bag if Claude or Sylar survived, so long as they refused to lynch one of their own).

Amb's ability was a powerful one, but was limited by the low number of scum in the game (in that he couldn't use it and kill, he'd either have to go completely defensive or stop using it if his partners were dead).

The theme I'd chosen for town members was characters targeted by PrimaTech early in the season; this is why we had Nathan Petrelli (who was briefly captured early on) but not Peter or Hiro (who may have been hard to balance in a small game anyway).

I'd appreciate any thoughts or criticisms you may have for me, either in this thread or via PM. I'm going to start a new signup thread for the mega (though I see that I'm still competing with Manatee mafia and two other signup threads). I hope you all join there. It will be best not to assume that every character from this game will be there, or that characters from this game will have the same alignment or abilities in that game. Probably best not to assume they won't be there with the same abilities and alignment, either
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[Sefer]

[theopholis]

Wow. I didn't foresee a town win that quickly even with two mafia lynches on days 1 and 2. It's unfortunate that Sylar got away, but we accomplished our primary objective with his help. So, I guess he wasn't all that bad.

I'm glad to see I was right about Livingod's safe claim. I had a feeling that's what it was. I would have happily voted for his lynch on day 2 if it looked like I would have had any support. It was a convenient coincidence that in between the original deadline time and the extended deadline time Amb made himself look scummy by trying to strengthen the case against lexprod.

Congratulations, town, on a flawless victory. And thanks, Sefer, for running this mini game. I'm definitely moving on to the mega.

After reading your huge analysis post, it seems like the game was well balanced. Had the mafia been a little better at covering up their scummy tendencies the game could have easily swung in their favor early on. I like the way the alternate win conditions for some of the characters mingled with the standard win conditions, and I think it worked well with the setting. Anyone who watched Heroes regularly knows that it is not always clear who is on what side and what certain characters' ulterior motives may be. I'll be interested to see how all of these roles interact once the mega game gets under way.
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I know it's hard to believe, but Round 2, Scene 2 is written and posted. (Insert exclamation of disbelief here.) Read the scene.

[Projectyl]

Ha-HA! Had a feeling that was going to happen.

The thing about my role is that not only did I have no motivation to kill, I would've actively benefited from not killing - if any scalped townie corpses at all showed up, there's no way you'd believe I was pro-town. Livingod's claim actually played right into that; he was a completely safe target for me, since if I targeted him, he'd only die if he was lying (and thus scum).

Everyone else did an amazing job with those first two lynches, though. Thanks for setting me up for the hammer.
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"I am now telling the computer exactly what it can do with a lifetime supply of chocolate..."

[CrashTextDummie]

Oh whoopsy, turns out the game sorted itself out during my absence. Well done, town.

I'm not exactly sure what happened there on Day 1, but I definitely didn't plan on being forced to claim this early, especially since I suspected that the mafia had a roleblocker. Quite frankly, I'm a bit baffled by the way scum chose to handle N1, specifically that they chose to neither kill nor block me.

The reason why I didn't investigate Livingod (which, I suspect, is what the scum anticipated, judging by Amb's play early in D2) is that I didn't trust to get an accurate result on him. In my mind, I found it to be possible that, if he was telling the truth, Livingod could be recruited into an anti-town group by HRG, thus rendering a N1 investigation on him moot. And if he was fake-claiming, then surely he'd have some kind of investigation immunity, since a cop-confirmed Unnkillable is such an insanely powerful role, and therefore such a tempting target for the cop, that claiming such a role without investigation immunity would be suicide.

I fully intended to investigate him on N2, though, and would have done so if I had been around.

Not a game I'm proud of on a personal level, but enjoyable none the less.

Thanks for modding, Sefer!

[Courk]

I really am surprised no one ever considered me to be really suspicious. I played way differently than I usually do.