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Osama is dead!!!
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Pablo
Never Draws a Blank



PostPosted: Thu May 05, 2011 6:40 pm    Post subject: 41 Reply with quote

Correction: They didn't watch the Soviets get decimated in Afghanistan. They, with the help of the U.S., were participants
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Antrax
ESL Student



PostPosted: Fri May 06, 2011 4:50 am    Post subject: 42 Reply with quote

Pablo wrote:
I obviously can't prove this is true, but the logic is sound and you'd have a hell of a time proving it's not true.
You'd have a hell of a time proving intelligent design (if that's offensive to some GLers, substitute with homeopathy) isn't true. Maybe it's not such a great criterion?
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Pablo
Never Draws a Blank



PostPosted: Fri May 06, 2011 12:55 pm    Post subject: 43 Reply with quote

Criterion for what?
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Johny Fake
Daedalian Member



PostPosted: Sat May 07, 2011 6:36 pm    Post subject: 44 Reply with quote

Pablo wrote:
Criterion for what?


Criterion for truth (inability to disprove).

I have read similar articles that quoted Osama, that indicated that financial bankruptcy of the US was a primary goal.

Osama did alright for one person if that was his mission. It's too bad we can't have a more intelligent, measured response to these things. But, perhaps we'll learn from this once the dust settles.

Al Qaeda will keep trying to bankrupt the American government (doubtful). So what. Freedom (of religion, of speech...), democracy, and capitalism will live on. In the long-term, the better ideas win. That's why religion's days are numbered. /End Troll
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Pablo
Never Draws a Blank



PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 1:00 am    Post subject: 45 Reply with quote

Johny Fake wrote:
Pablo wrote:
Criterion for what?


Criterion for truth (inability to disprove).


But I wasn't making a case for "truth" any more than I would make a case for "truth" when discussing God.

I think Antrax completely missed my point....which was that there is a hell of a lot of evidence to suggest that ObL's strategy was to bankrupt us and that killing a few of us was only a vehicle for terrifying all of us into squandering our resources.

The reason I even mentioned "proving" was that I was trying to prevent the "cite please" response that people seem to think is so brilliant. I was simply putting forth a likely scenario. I believe Antrax did the only legitimate thing when confronted with "criterion for what?" by not answering. There really is no answer since I didn't pretend to state a fact nor did I attempt to present a case of logic. I think my point is very VERY worth considering, whatever conclusion you might come to.
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Thok
Oh, foe, the cursed teeth!



PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 1:05 pm    Post subject: 46 Reply with quote

Rather than making this an argument about what truth is, I just took the minute to google osama bankrupt america, and found this article for 2004. (It's a CNN article about a Bin Laden tape released by Al-Jazeera that talks about bankrupting the US.)

Remember people, it takes minimal time to use google to help your position. And doing so prevents both sides of the argument from looking like fools.
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Pablo
Never Draws a Blank



PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 2:09 pm    Post subject: 47 Reply with quote

Thok wrote:


Remember people, it takes minimal time to use google to help your position. And doing so prevents both sides of the argument from looking like fools.


Pablo in Post 40 wrote:
For more, google "bin laden plan to bankrupt us"

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Antrax
ESL Student



PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 2:31 pm    Post subject: 48 Reply with quote

Thok wrote:
And doing so prevents both sides of the argument from looking like fools.
What two sides? I pointed out that something being difficult to disprove says nothing about whether it's true or not.
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Thok
Oh, foe, the cursed teeth!



PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 2:49 pm    Post subject: 49 Reply with quote

Antrax wrote:
Thok wrote:
And doing so prevents both sides of the argument from looking like fools.
What two sides? I pointed out that something being difficult to disprove says nothing about whether it's true or not.


Well, yes. Having reread the argument, I see you aren't debating whether Osama has claimed he was trying to bankrupt America, but whether that was just a propaganda statement Osama made and his real goals were different. I definitely feel foolish.

(I'm still think Pablo ought to have taken the minute or two to actually post evidence supporting his likely scenario: if he wants people to consider a scenario, then he should show us the decency to actually point out that he's considered what the scenario means as well.)
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Pablo
Never Draws a Blank



PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 2:54 pm    Post subject: 50 Reply with quote

Thok wrote:


(I'm still think Pablo ought to have taken the minute or two to actually post evidence supporting his likely scenario:


and this wasn't enough? (there looked to be so much information there that I decided anyone who was interested could choose rather than me trying to filter it.)
Quote:
For more, google "bin laden plan to bankrupt us"


Not really sure what your point or your problem is.

Quote:
if he wants people to consider a scenario, then he should show us the decency to actually point out that he's considered what the scenario means as well.)


Decency? How's this for decency: Fuck you.
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Thok
Oh, foe, the cursed teeth!



PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 3:08 pm    Post subject: 51 Reply with quote

Pablo wrote:
Decency? How's this for decency: Fuck you.


I guess I'll have to agree to disagree with you on how to present a position.
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Lepton*
Guest



PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2011 12:19 pm    Post subject: 52 Reply with quote

Oh god, even in death Osama bin Laden's plan to disrupt the GL is coming to fruition! He's the Hari Seldon of radicalism!
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Antrax
ESL Student



PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2011 12:59 pm    Post subject: 53 Reply with quote

I don't remember a time in which the GL lacked radicalism (is that a word?). It just used to be more civil.
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Death Mage
Raving Lunatic



PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2011 2:42 pm    Post subject: 54 Reply with quote

Used to be more civil? I can't tell if your sarcasm tag is broken...

Seriously, this site used to have some pretty big blow-up fights, tons of name calling etc. It looks like things have gotten far more civil to me.
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Zag
Unintentionally offensive old coot



PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2011 3:12 pm    Post subject: 55 Reply with quote

And we appreciate your newfound restraint, DM. Enthusiastic Grin
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The Ragin' South Asian
Head Poncho



PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2011 5:12 pm    Post subject: 56 Reply with quote

In case anyone hasn't seen this yet.
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Mr Nigma
CLASSIFIED



PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2011 11:09 pm    Post subject: 57 Reply with quote

The video of the Seal who killed Osama.
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Antrax
ESL Student



PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2011 6:24 am    Post subject: 58 Reply with quote

BTW, Pablo, are you still tracking the story? Specifically, those excerpts from Bin Laden's diaries that talk about how he only wants to kill Americans and wonders how many he has to kill to get the US to back off Arab countries?
Of course, it's probably a hoax he planted to throw us off his real intentions.
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Jack_Ian
Big Endian



PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2011 12:52 pm    Post subject: 59 Reply with quote

When somebody without a vested interest reports that stuff, I might begin to give it some credence.

Wife1: Don't give up. We can still win.
Osama: We can't win. America will never leave while there is still oil in the Middle-East.
Wife1: Maybe another "spectacular", derail a rush-hour train or something.
Osama: How many innocents will die? How many Americans do you think must die before they give up their grip on our oil?
Wife1: I see your point. Perhaps you're right. I'll go call them and let them know where to come to accept our surrender.

... later ...

Osama: They're here.
Wife1: OK Let's go. Remember to say the code. "Hive Hooked Ear Muddier"
Osama: I AM UNARMED! I FOOKED YER MUDDER!
<BANG!>

President: Well done men. His defence would have been far too embarrassing. This should keep the skeletons buried once and for all.

Spin: Osama was talking about derailing a train that would kill Americans and wondered how many deaths it would take to win the war.

Of course, the above scenario is all nonsense and it is far more likely that he actually was planning something, but I think expecting any more than a sprinkle of truth in reports about this is a little naïve.
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Antrax
ESL Student



PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2011 7:29 pm    Post subject: 60 Reply with quote

The alternative seems to be an Aristotelian approach to the world. I think there was a reason we moved away from that.
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Lifeinmomland
Soccer, dance, doctor's appt. this AM.



PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2011 9:32 pm    Post subject: 61 Reply with quote

definition of war

–noun
1.
a conflict carried on by force of arms, as between nations or between parties within a nation; warfare, as by land, sea, or air.
2.
a state or period of armed hostility or active military operations: The two nations were at war with each other.
3.
a contest carried on by force of arms, as in a series of battles or campaigns: the War of 1812.

–verb (used without object)
10.
to make or carry on war; fight: to war with a neighboring nation.
11.
to carry on active hostility or contention: Throughout her life she warred with sin and corruption.
12.
to be in conflict or in a state of strong opposition: The temptation warred with his conscience.

This is what he SAID he was fighting for... but last I checked the twin towers were NOT in Saudi Arabia.

On August 23, 1996, bin Laden issued Al Qaeda’s first “declaration of war” against America, his “Message from Osama bin Laden to his Muslim brothers in the whole world and especially in the Arabian Peninsula: declaration of jihad against the Americans occupying the Land of the Two Holy Mosques (Saudi Arabia); expel the heretics from the Arabian Peninsula.”

Subsequently, Al Qaeda escalated its war against the U.S. In August 1998, Al Qaeda bombed two U.S. embassies in East Africa (Nairobi, Kenya, and Dar es Salaam, Tanzania) killing more than 200 people, including 12 Americans. In retaliation, the U.S. attacked targets in Sudan and Afghanistan. In October 2000, Al Qaeda bombed the U.S.S. Cole, an American guided-missile destroyer at Aden, Yemen, killing 17 American servicemen. It committed its most devastating attack on September 11, 2001, when 19 Al Qaeda operatives hijacked four passenger planes and drove two into the Twin Towers in New York City and one into the Pentagon; a fourth plane crashed in rural Pennsylvania. Nearly 3,000 people were killed in the attack.

You may not like to call it a war, but they felt it was, and that will not end with the death of one man. There will be new faces that come forward. He was not the only leader just a familar one from his long history of warfare and terror. Remember he was 54 years old and he was involved in war all the way back to Russia's time in the middle East.
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