WSU IS&T 1100 Week 8-9

[firemeboy]

Hackers and politics. Should prove to be interesting. Hackers hate politicians (or the government in general), and the government is so good at screwing things up and technology has allowed them to do so with much greater speed and scope.

[Allaround1]

I thought the presentation on cracking today was excellent. Probably not exactely what all of you wanted to hear, but if you had a general knowledge about computers and an interest you could pull some really good info out of the presentation. The hacking discussion should also be interesting, I cant wait to see what the teach brings to the table.

[Allaround1]

Anyone interested for education only purposes I'm sure. The software that can be used to rip dvd's that was undiscussed today is, 321 studios, and part of the 321 studios software is smart ripper, also there is another one called equiduer, not sure if I spelled that right. 321 studios will also rip gamecube games to, I'm pretty sure. Anyways, there ya go fella's

[Kanchaser]

I am very interested to hear about the differences of the many types of Hacking. I think it is cool to have the type of ethics that the good hackers have. I almost wish that people in the business world were the same. If they lie and cheat and do something dishonest then I wish every other top dog businessman would do the same as the hackers; and dog on them. I wish that they would let them know how much of a discrace they are to the business world and that they better watch out because they will be watching that person!

[Arsenalrocks]

Last class was really interesting. It's interesting to see the different classifications of hacker and crakers. I was totally unaware that they had a code of ethics involved and that they were this big group. I just thought that they were independant people that really didn't associate with each other. That just goes to show how ignorant I am.

[Spanglish]

Its like the teach said, if someone stole your car, took it for a ride and brought it back with a full tank of gas, new tires, and a souped up motor that gets better gas mileage would you be mad? He compared that with hackers that break in and fix systems.. Well the way I see it, I still have a bad idea of hackers, even if they have a code of ethics. They are still criminals to me until they break into my computer and help me out.. Thats the way most Americans are, we dont like something until it helps us out directly.

[chocolate]

I'm not so sure I would want hackers going into my computer ever - even to fix something. They are still invading my privacy - even if they are doing good. But a friend of mine at Utah State got a email message saying that they had been into her computer and suggested she disconnect from the ethernet every time she was finished on the computer. That was helpful to her. Still it seems they should just stay out.

[Allaround1]

I hate this discussion board, no one ever comments on what other people say. I could tell all of you to go to hell and you'd just say, um, I think computers are neat.

[xcrystalheartx]

...computers ARE neat.

[xcrystalheartx]

one of my friends is like excellent at breaking into people's emails. --she is just good at guessing passwords though, i dont know if that's really hacking/cracking..but if she knows them even a bit, she can get it within a matter of minutes...it's kinda cool. i wouldn't want someone doing it to me, but...none the less.

[volrath]

Hacking is a good thing to know how to do i think because if you know how to do it then you also should know how to protect yourself from the hackers that want to get your information. I thought the movie "the Net" was great because it showed realy what people could do with your personal info.

[Cheese]

[dazedconfused]

hacking would definaltly have it's advantages

[allstate]

I say Hack on to the Hackers and Crack on to the Crackers. They are going to help the world in its issues of security and define the ever evolving world of technology. Pretend that the car (using the example from Spanglish by the teach) they take out to soup up is not yours in particular, a similar model borrowed from the car maker itself. The upgrades are accomplished, you cruise the internet find and install the upgrades (IF YOU CHOOSE) and it works out for everybody, the lesser is he who is ignorant to somebody elses helpful contribution and dosen't take the help. We'll all learn.

[Don Jones]

I think Spanglish has a good point. I would say people(not just Americans)
don’t like, or are afraid of what they don’t understand and don’t have complete control over. Yes hackers do serve a purpose and can help in various ways. But there is some risk involved. You can’t trust someone 100%. They are human and I’m positive they are often times tempted to do something “just for fun”. No doubt they are a mischievous breed, which would cause some concern. Plus I don’t think they pose much of a threat, (they probably wish they did) the only thing that has messed with my bank account is myself.


[This message has been edited by Don Jones (edited 03-07-2003 02:02 PM).]

[firemeboy]

Just to comment on Allaround's comment, remember, you get credit for either posting your thoughts, or replying to other people's comments. You don't have to bring up something completley new. Feel free to flame... er, respond to other people.

I for one am interested in the whole MAIM or MIME or whatever that program is...

[catman]

I feel that hackers are an asset to the internet. You will never know how save your software and sysem are until someone breaks through it. There are always tests done to see how well things hold up, hackers are the testers of the internet. As long as they hold to their "code" then it shouldn't get to messed up. I knew a man in the special forces and he said that the govt. had him and his team sneak into bases (american) and take things or so other things. They did it often to test the security of the base. We need someone to te testing and making improvements to the internet!

[Mack]

You know my opinon about hackers and crackers is this: They suck..... Any person that is out there primaraly tring to make your life or your companies life hell needs to be put away.... Long gone, in the slammer. They cannot think of anything better to do than sit on there fat BUTT, and hack, hack, hack away. I got a job for them, it is called Clean up Washington Blvd. Now with that said, does anyone have a good hack for Windows XP, or knows where I could get one???

[karrots]

As for the definitions of Hackers vs. Crackers. My line of thought was close to what Marion told us in class. Hackers are those that brought us Personal computers as we have them today. They brought us such programing languages as C because they wanted to do somthing computers couldn't do etc.. Hence the Hack is kind of like when you jimmy rig(or what ever you want to call it) somthing. As far as crackers. I always thought of breaking copy protection schemes etc... If you are looking for a crack for a program you are looking for a CD key or activation code for your software.

As far as White Hat vs. Black Hat hackers . There are many groups of White Hat hackers that are very respected. Many are famous names in the computing industry. They are usually inventors of technologies that we use today. Some good examples are SecurityFocus There are many high profile mailing lists such as BugTraq which tracks bugs in programs usually exploits. Another good example of White Hat hackers would be Symantec. They are always out trying to thwart the next virus. They also have network security products.

Some other examples:
www.insecure.org
www.2600.org - More phreaking and Grey Hat areas.

The terms in this post were defined by: The Jargon File. There are more than just terms there. It defines hackers and gives kind of a profile its pretty good.

Karrots

[This message has been edited by karrots (edited 03-08-2003 07:31 PM).]

[shining gundam]

Mack: So I guess we should lock you up in jail for hacking Windows XP? Or would the person who created the hack have to go jail even though you were the one who used it? Anyways on with the show!
As long as hackers aren't doing any damage I don't have a problem with them. If that is what they want to do then good for them. I would say that we owe a lot to hackers (some of them). They have helped to advance computer security and that is something we can all appreciate.
But with the good comes the bad. I guess if someone can do something they will even if they shouldn't. People could cause some serious damage if they really wanted to and that should make everybody else leary. Just a short while ago a worm was unleashed on servers all over the US and elsewhere and that caused major headaches for companies and schools, etc. It's not very comforting to know that anybody who knows how to use a search engine can find out how to make a virus.
That is just my two cents!

[Allaround1]

Hey, I dont understand what the deal is with the essay! You go to the portfolio and click on week 8 right? Then it says we have to do 4 1-2 page essays, I thought we only had to do one, 4 seems like a little much!!! Please let me know so I can get it done. Thanks!

[karrots]

Originally posted by AllAround1:

---

Hey, I dont understand what the deal is with the essay! You go to the portfolio and click on week 8 right? Then it says we have to do 4 1-2 page essays, I thought we only had to do one, 4 seems like a little much!!!

---

I think its a total of four for the semester. The last one being the essay about the online project.

While I am at it I have a question for everyone. Who here were BBSers and what were your favorite things to do on them. Were you a message board type person, chat, or door games! If door games what were your favorite ones. Mine were TradeWars, LORD, and BRE. Man they were fun. It was always exciting to come home from school fire up the 2400 Baud Modem and start hitting the Busy signals trying to get in. Oh, also what boards were you on? I can't remember any names of the ones I was on. I will post later if I think of any.

Karrots

[Jaamal]

The discussion on hackers was interesting, I did not know anything about them but it seems for the most part the aren't doing anything wrong. It would be a fun hobbie to be a hacker. It was suprising to me that they have a code of ethics,we should let them do what they like the government should not give them crap unless they do something illegal. I hate when tree huger's complain, what bitch and moan about hunting. It's my favorite hobbie and it's what I like to do,hackers probably feel the same.

[allstate]

Wow I thought I was the only one that used to get on to the BBS. It seems to me that we just goofed around, maybe got some pictures of women in bikinis and maybe some other lame games. The reality that is remembered from having to outwait the modem, that rules. I can't say I remember any of the board names but I can say I've been there and done that.

[TGR]

Hackers as long as they don't do anything bad have they broken any laws? I don't think so. Crackers on the other hand if they take their cracks and use them for personal gain then that would be bad. I am against priacy. Yes Karrots I too BBSed back in the day. It was really cool to come home from school and just plug around on the comp. Usually just play texted based games. LORD, Trade Wars, Usurper etc. Or I really enjoyed those shareware games. They kick trashed anyone here every play commander keen. Those old Apogee games are really cool. I have tried to find them (shareware versions) on the net and have had little success. I did on the other hand for a while play Trade Wars and Lord on the internet by telneting to someones BBS that they for some reason are still running on the net. Anyways if people are stupid enough to leave their stuff out hackers should have the right to go through it ;Þ

TGR

[VinnyQ]

Sorry to butt-in a bit, but I've only discovered what you guys are discussing in here. Very good topic for discussion indeed.

I am currently reading a book called "Hackers: Heroes of the Computer Revolution" by Steven Levy, and it's a wonderful book.

If you have any interest what so ever in the Hackers Ethic and the early stories of "Hacking" and the Computer Revolution, I highly recommend it.

[Beebs]

I say that as long as no laws are broken are anyone or anything is hurt in the process to let the hackers that are trying to improve stuff do what they want within reason.

[DNA]

The discussion in class about Hackers this past week was very interesting to me, I always assumed Hackers were people breaking into secure info. on the net, and being wanted by the FBI, this is what alot of movies portrays them out to be as. Though after learning that they do help out comp. programs by speeding them up and other such things, my view is different. I feel as long as there not breaking any rules, and staying out of peoples personal information, I don't really have to much of a problem with Hackers.

[GUITARPRO#1]

Hi,

I think anything that takes an idea and expands on it or improves it can't hurt. When people harm others in any way it's not cool. On the news they said that Texas University was just hit by hackers who broke into their system and made off with tons of personal information of students and faculty (past and present), they said they were warning everyone involved. Another interesting article I read was one about record sales and who suffers from the different downloads and burnings of songs. This article was on msn.coms news page, I don't know if it is still up.

[Larin]

For the longest time I thought a Hacker was a Cracker. basically I thought they were the same thing. I always thought they were against the law. All of them. Basically because of what DNA said. All the movies make you think that Hackers all live running away from the law trying not to get caught. Like The Matrix when Neo lives 2 lives. The last few days in class have really opened my Eyes to what Hackers really are.

[princesspony]

i will admit, that i was a little under read on all the terms out there for this subject and now that i look back at things i have read, i see how easy it is for people like myself to easily assume everyone is a hacker and hackers to bad things and do this or that..i'm an idiot...the next point...if they can get in, they deserve to do what ever they want...it may not be right, but maybe we should be more educated in the things we use and place so much faith in...sure you feel violated..
but what are you going to do after that...just hope it doesn't happen again...oh and guitarpro#1, you're looking pretty good..

[ChinaMan]

Yes, I think most of us were "dazed and confused" as to the exact definitions of the terms "hackers" and "crackers". You must admit though, it would sound exciting to be able to tell someone that you are a hacker.
"Well Bob, what do you do for a living?" "I'm a HACKER!"
It just doesn't sound as tantelizing if you were to say "I'm a cracker!"

[Spanglish]

I, for one, and looking forward to a new topic tomorrow in class.

[firemeboy]

[firemeboy]

Oh, and All around. Yes, four was the total (from last semester). We only do three this semester. But you only had to answer one this go around.

[VinnyQ]

I would have loved to visit your class just to sit in at your lectures, marion =)

[Spanglish]

Hola all, How did everyone enjoy the class tuesday on child pornography? Well, I am against censorship on the internet but I definately support Officer Layton and his cause, I say catch all those psychos and throw them in jail for as long as you can.

[firemeboy]

The 'regulars' on this board are actually discussin this very topic. I asked them what they thought about what was being done). There are a few people who think what LT. Layton is doing is wrong. Here is a link to the thread. Feel free to add your own input.


http://www.greylabyrinth.com/Forums/Forum7/HTML/004695.html?72

[Gelit]

Today's class was very intersting. The comments posted on here & on the link the teach just provided are all valid points of concern. Gotta say though... I tip my hat off to Mr Layton & all those that help get these losers locked up. I think it's excellent preventative work on their part & I commend them & the program. YOU CAN'T MOLEST OR RAPE WITHOUT HAVING FIRST THOUGHT ABOUT IT & I THINK PART OF ACTING ON THAT THOUGHT IS ACTUALLY GETTING ONLINE AND THEN SETTING UP A TIME & PLACE TO HOOKUP W/SOME INNOCENT CHILD!!! We wanna get this perverts before the extremely destructive part of their sickness harms someone else. Nobody goes to the grocery store NOT to buy anything - just hang out for no reason. They set a time & place up to do this & say they weren't going to do anything ... just thinkin' bout it???? Yeah, sure. I think this is a great thing they're doing. Oh yeah... Hey Marion... could you post that site up here that you were talkin' bout in class? The one where you can see who is a convicted sicko? Please & thank you... Just wanna see if any of us are in the same situation as you... a neighbor bein' one of em... ???...???

[chocolate]

So much for a shopping trip to Salt Lake. Am I sorry I missed class on Tuesday - sounds like it was a very interesting topic. I think they should catch child molesters ANY WAY THEY CAN!!! and then hang them by their "you know whats"!