Lord of The Rings thread 2 [FINITO!] post game blabber occur

[Logain]

6 of us left. Anyone else think it's time to just come out and reveal roles at this point?

[quercitron]

Well, let's see. We have Gandalf, Pippin, Gloin, an unknown, and two Orcs. I'd say it's about time.

I'm Gloin, the last dwarf Mason. I wish we'd obtained one of the special abilities Macros told us we could have, but sadly, we didn't; all I am is a Townie (lone Mason,) and I have no way of proving my innocence (or my Masonhood, for that matter, but a Mafioso would be a fool to challenge it.)

Mike Amok = Gandalf
querci = Gloin

Diplomat
Logain
Porro
Quailman

[Diplomat]

Damn, I thought we would have already won by now. I think this is one of those days where our lynch decides the fate of the game, so we have to vote carefully. So it's a good idea to disclose our roles today.

[Mike_Amok]

So do it already!

[Diplomat]

Okay, I was hoping someone would go before me, but since we already have 2 claimed roles, here goes (and this is embarrassing ). I'm Arwen. My father was Elrond.

[mole]

Pippin had better survive - if he dies, who's going to finish our book?

[Logain]

Well that was enough to convince me...

Vote: quercitron

I'm the real Gloin. It's kind of funny that until quercitron tried to claim the role, I didn't know Macros posted the whole email revealing that Damelon, Arminger and I were masons. I was beginning to wonder how he knew there were only 3 of us and that we knew each other.

[Porro]

Ok.
I'll claim my role now.
I'm Pippin.
If any mafia scum want's to challenge that by claiming the role themself, then please do so, 'cos I've got info to back up my claim.

[Macros]

1 querci (logain)

[quercitron]

Absolute bullshit. Don't let him fool you. Confirm vote: Logain

I figured the Mafia, with two left, might try something like this. One down.

Diplomat, want to tell us what Arwen *does,* or shall we just assume you're lying?

[Logain]

Originally posted by quercitron:

---

I have no way of proving my innocence (or my Masonhood, for that matter, but a Mafioso would be a fool to challenge it

---

My feeling exactly, and I'm not a fool.
I suggested right away to reveal roles this day, and I purposely held back waiting to see if anyone tried to claim my role.

Where is everyone btw? I would think a controversy over a role claim would bring everyone to vote right away.

[Mike_Amok]

Still waiting to hear Quailman's role claim.

[quercitron]

Neither am I a fool. I also suggested revealing roles, and I hinted at my role yesterday in my analysis post, hoping that the Mafia would just skim over it. Which you did. There's no controversy - you're orc scum. When people get back and read the thread, you're going to die.

[Quailman]

I'm not supposed to vote until a bandwagon forms or make any constructive comments of any sort. That's all I'll say for now.

[quercitron]

Quailman: what the heck?

Diplomat - claims Arwen
Logain - claims Gloin, is lying orc scum
Mike Amok - claims Gandalf, cleared beyond reasonable doubt
Porro - claims Pippin, no one is challenging
Quailman - claims restrictions on role, no talking?
quercitron - claims Gloin, dwarf Mason, challenged by lying orc scum Logain.

Okay, let me try to think clearly. Porro is telling the truth since no one is challenging him. Mike Amok is obviously Gandalf. I know Logain is scum, but since that obviously isn't so clear to everyone else (or he wouldn't have tried this gambit,) to the casual observer one of Logain and I is scum.

That leaves Diplomat and Quailman. Diplomat claimed Arwen, who was there in the movie (for obvious reasons) but I think not as much in the books, and hasn't provided any role claim information. Quailman, if I read correctly, is claiming that he can't talk about his role or make any constructive comments. I don't think I believe it, but maybe I'm missing something obvious.

This, of course, doesn't matter until tomorrow, since Logain is orc scum and if we lynch him and prove so I die tonight, but for future reference I'm more suspicious of Diplomat. Several people have tried to start mini bandwagons against him already and they've all failed, like they were diverted.

[Macros]

Vote count

1 quercitron (logain)
1 Logain (Quercitron)

[Mike_Amok]

[Quailman]

I got in trouble (with the Mod) on day one for jumping on too soon. I can't believe you guys never noticed that after that I only voted when the bandwagon was halfway or so. I have no original thoughts. I just do what everybody seems to want. I'm not supposed to reveal this until you guys voted for me - I am at least intelligent enough to know I'm innocent. But I don't think I ever got a vote, let alone a bandwagon so I could reveal my role. Go figure.

I might get killed by the Mod tonight for breaking my role's 'rules'. I guess I could have been oblique enough to draw a couple of votes today. It seems to have worked out so far in that we've lynched quite a few bad guys. I didn't know about Werebear (I'm a little slow, remember?) yesterday, but he already had half of the votes he needed for a lynch, so I had to climb on. At this point, maybe I'm a bit risky to have around. In the earlier rounds, I could see how this role might have helped speed up the game. If we lynch the wrong one today and one (other than me) dies tonight, I would just be the deciding vote tomorrow (3/4).

Oh, and my name is Daisy Gardner. I have no idea who that is, just as I have frequently been uncertain whether we've lynched a baddie or good guy. I'm somebody's niece or something.

Note to Mod: I still haven't offered anything meaningful about whom to lynch today.

[Quailman]

When I said I have no idea who Daisy Gardner is, I meant that I don't remember her from the movie, and I never read the books.

[Porro]

Are you sure your first name isn't Dizzy?

[Porro]

Ok.
Only 1 death last night.
Does that mean that at most there will be only 1 death tonight?
Maybe we should start thinking tactically, rather than trying to figure out who's the liar between q and L.

e.g.
We lynch L today, but find him to be town. Leaves 3t + 2orcs (assuming the unknown is town).
Townie dies overnight. Leaves 2t + 2o
Lynch stalemate.
Townie dies overnight... town loses. Bah forget tactics for now. We must lynch an orc today or we're doomed.

On first sight it looks like a choice between q and L. But I'm very suspicious of the obtuse way Q posted. Is that normal for him?

[Porro]

Originally posted by Logain:

---

It's kind of funny that until quercitron tried to claim the role, I didn't know Macros posted the whole email revealing that Damelon, Arminger and I were masons.

---

What post number was that revelation Logain?

[Diplomat]

Quercitron wants to know what Arwen does. Well, basically, if anyone that's good targets me at night, they get protection. Also, I can hide from killers every other night.

Maybe I missed this, but I have no idea what Gloin, Gandalf, and Pippin do. Well, I gather that Gloin and/or Pippin are masons. But I'd like to know the descriptions of all claimed roles.

This controversy between Quercitron and Logain is getting interesting. I will FOS: both Quercitron and Logain for now because it's not obvious who's the Orc right now. (Or maybe both of them are? Hmm, if that's the case, then it'll dissociate one from the other.) Logain, what are you referring to where Macros mentioned that you were a mason?

[Porro]

[Mike_Amok]

Well, I haven't read any of the books or seen the movie. But the World Wide Web tells me that Daisy Gardner is a daughter of Sam. One of many. And I don't see that there's anything special about her or indeed Sam's children altogether that Macros would include her. However lesser Arwen's role is in the books compared to the film, I imagine Daisy Gardner's is ludicrously more obscure in comparison.

Originally posted by Quailman:

---

I got in trouble (with the Mod) on day one for jumping on too soon. I can't believe you guys never noticed that after that I only voted when the bandwagon was halfway or so.

---

And what about day two, mith got 3 votes right off the bat, and you posted...

[Mike_Amok]

And yeah, as I said, exactly one of Logain and quercitron is lying, and the other is telling the truth. Unless, of course, Diplomat or Quailman is actually Gloin and has gone mad.

[Porro]

Nice one Gandalf.

You've obviously put a lot of work into checking back, and come up with some great info by the sound of it. It's a bit late in the UK (ahem I mean the shire) so I'll check the threads, as you suggest, tomorrow.

I don't suppose you've got post numbers for the specific posts you referenced have you? I do intend to check the whole threads, but the post numbers would be handy.

[Porro]

Originally posted by Mike_Amok:

---

Unless, of course, Diplomat or Quailman is actually Gloin and has gone mad.

---

Don't put ideas into their heads

[Mike_Amok]

Reply 282, Quailman: "Before this gets out of hand... I will vote: Diplomat."
Reply 390, Quailman: "unvote: Diplomat; vote: Jeep"

Reply 976, amb: "Logain attacked and killed Antrax."
Reply 990, Damelon: "Amb is lying. Vote: amb"

[Edit: obviously that's all in the original thread.]

[This message has been edited by Mike_Amok (edited 11-14-2002 07:50 PM).]

[Logain]

Mike_Amok, good memory or at least researching those posts and Damelon's support for me. I just spent the last 10 minutes tracking down those posts myself to find you already posted it...lol

I think on more than a few occasions in the beginning the 3 of us were voting for the same person in a bandwagon as well...minus quercitron of course.

I can't stress enough that we need to lynch quercitron now to avoid a stalemate tomorrow and an eventual loss for the town. FOS: Quailman for what seems to be contradictions in his role claim.

[quercitron]

Yeah, Damelon never explained why he did that, not that we communicated at night much other than to decide if we were going to do anything tricky in our posts to prove Masonry. We ended up saying no; the best way to win such a game is to keep quiet and use the Masonry to advantage in the endgame.

We are now in the endgame. And yes, I am normally like this when I am still alive in an endgame; read anything.

Logain is scum. I am Gloin, Damelon and Arminger were my fellow Masons. I can't prove it, obviously, and I'm not about to quote our communication. I don't know what else I can say, but I can't be lynched today or we will have a stalemate, and the Mafia will win.

Actually, another thought has occurred to me. What if there are actually three evils left alive (two Orcs and a Serial Killer of some sort.) I've been trying to pick the other Mafia out from Quailman and Diplomat, who are both suspicious, but they could both be evil. We haven't seen much evidence of another killer though, so unless he's vindictive like Gollum or something.

Well, I know what to do. We can't keep arguing this. I know Logain is scum; if he gets lynched we're one scum closer to winning. Vote: Logain

[Porro]

Ok.
I'm up to page 10, and I'm convinced that Quail is lying about the 50% of lynch votes before he votes thing. Not only, as MA pointed out, was he the 1st to vote for Diplomat on day 2, but he was also the second on that day to vote for Jeep. All after he was 'allegedly' slapped about by mole for voting too soon on day 1.
I'll carry on and post an update later.

[Porro]

Page 16, still day 2.
In case I was in any doubt whatsoever, Quail has innce voted for Leonidas, Horserider, and Cyberdork.

Heavens above Q, if you're going to spin a lie of a role claim, make it a bit plausible you ugly Ork!

[Porro]

Also on day 2, Log FOS'd amb, shortly after the other two dwarfs had voted for him, and at a point when only 4 votes in total were against amb, as opposed to 10 against Leonidas at that point.

[Porro]

Mmm. Day 2.
Dameleon (dwarf) swapped votes lots, but heavily criticised anyone voting Leonidas (that included Logain and Diplomat). Eventually the bandwaggon landed on werebear. Sami, Fezik and q did some major lurking, but q got on the wearbear bandwaggon before wb said 'die mortal pigs' (paraphrase). Logain only got on after wb said that.

[Porro]

p.s. that's up to page 20.

[Porro]

BTW everyone apart from Mike is quite welcome to plough through the threads to hunt mafia/ justify their towniness!

The fact it's gone so quiet leads me to believe that Gandalf's call is bob on, and the mafia are just waiting to die now. So Q and q, if you're not mafia, please trawl the threads for evidence, no matter how tenuous.

Go on Q have a go, I could do with a good laugh

[Diplomat]

Whoa, I didn't know Macros had a site about this game with all the role descriptions. One thing I noticed about the Fellowship group was that it says they may not reveal their abilities, but their abilities are stated right there. I don't know if Macros should have posted all these role descriptions before the end of the game.

Anyway, I trust Mike_Amok and Porro at this point. It looks like they have come up with some substantial evidence against Quailman, and they are leaning toward quercitron as being the orc. I think the game is almost solved. I'm going to have to look back at the thread to convince myself more, though I don't know when I'll have the opportunity.

[Porro]

P25, end of day 3.
Didn't spot much that day :/

[Porro]

Day 4 was very short.
Helped by amb accusing Logain, and a dwarf leaping to his derence.