Discuss The Creator here

[MatthewV]

Link to puzzle

[Ctorj]

I found a poem titled:
The Artist
by Kathleen Dreckman

[Ctorj]

For some reason, I thought it was the history of the Supreme Court judges over time, but not it. The Court began with 6 and now has 9 so that's a fizzle.

[3iff]

The top circle has one different symbol, the third circle has 2 different symbols and the fifth circle has 1 different symbol.

The red lines suggest links to other main circles or the centre.

No idea about the 7 small circles around the centre circle...

The poem means nothing. I thought a hint might lie in the other verses but nothing suggests itself.

[Foggy]

Given the other poems by Dreckman, and the title of this puzzle, I have to wonder if there is a religious theme to this puzzle.

Another possibility is that it has something to do with letters of the alphabet...there are 26 symbols in the five outer circles, with five having unusual markings.

[3iff]

I only see 4...

[Foggy]

One of the black triangles with three tan lines appears to have two gray notches, upon very close inspection...however, that could just be the difficulty I'm having focusing on the image...

Speaking of which, can we get a larger version of the image?

[3iff]

The number of red lines connecting to the outer circles is exactly twice the number of symbols in the circle.

The top circle has a thick red line to the north and this system works if the thick line counts as 3.

I've no idea what this might mean but as it is (mostly) consistent it might be important.

[jja]

It would be nice if the more intricate diagram puzzles could be illustrated in vector format using Adobe Illustrator, Xara or the like; then a PDF could be made and one could enlarge the view without losing any detail. (I'm skilled in creating vector art, and I'd be happy to donate some time to a diagram maker who's interested in trying it that way.)

One observation... The three balls in the center section which have stripes at the top and bottom are not all alike; two have a brown/gold stripe at the top and one has a purple stripe. I didn't notice this until I enlarged the image.
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JJA
"Sancte," inquit, "quare, quaeso, rapis arborem festam?"

[Lucky Wizard]

Foggy: If you're referring to the notches at the very top, all of the triangles have these... If you're referring to something else, I'm guessing it's just a figment of your imagination, as some very close inspection, including magnification, suggests it's all black except for the tan lines and the two corners.

A thought on the actual puzzle: Perhaps the six nodes represent people -- perhaps six characters in something, with one being somehow central?

[Ctorj]

I noticed something else: The middle circle is short a line on the "2 lines for every symbol" theory. The only way to make it work is to assume that the line that circles around the top circle is two lines though I don't buy that because it looks just as thick as the others. It looks thicker, but when you zoom in, it only looks thicker because it is straight.

Also, I think that the fact that the straight line goes around the top circle may be an important clue to this puzzle. Why is that line not diagonal like the rest? And why is the top-most circle 2 lines short unless the thick line really is 3 lines which is a little bit of a stretch, but not that much.

Last thought: I keep thinking this is some sort of diagram of how government works, but the US only has three branches.
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"Love is the absolute expression of the human perfection" -Me!

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[3iff]

Where the symbols are different in the top and third circles (counting clockwise) then difference in in purple. In the 5th circle, it looks like the difference is in black but it's hard to tell.

I would guess that as the diagram is of relatively poor quality that the slight differences are not critical to solving the puzzle...but if the differences are there they must have some importance??

The angular line going north from the centre just looks like an inelegant way of drawing what should be a straight line without passing through the small circle.

[Tony Gardner]

[3iff]

One idea I've had nagging at me is this...although I have no idea how most of it fits

In Greek astronomy, they knew of 7 planets...Sun, Moon, Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter and Saturn. These 'might' be the 7 small circles around a bigger circle (Earth?). Geocentric, you know.

What anything else might be I currently have no idea...although the 5 Platonic solids and 13 Platonic elements might fit the 5 large outer circles and 13 lines emanating from the small centre circle.

Shoot it down.

[3iff]

One idea I've had nagging at me is this...although I have no idea how most of it fits

In Greek astronomy, they knew of 7 planets...Sun, Moon, Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter and Saturn. These 'might' be the 7 small circles around a bigger circle (Earth?). Geocentric, you know.

What anything else might be I currently have no idea...although the 5 Platonic solids and 13 Platonic elements might fit the 5 large outer circles and 13 lines emanating from the small centre circle.

Shoot it down.

[Protected]

[mikeamok]

i didn't notice until i saw the original, but the large circles are not all of the same whiteness. the center and upper-left circles are slightly yellowish, while the other four are slightly grayish. the upper-left circle is more yellowish in the original.

[jja]

Partly to test my understanding, I have presumed so far as to redraw the graphic as vector art. It can be viewed with Acrobat reader and zoomed using the magnifying glass tool.

http://www.pageatatime.com/images/gl/creator_puzzle.pdf

On the blue triangles at top, it looked like there were supposed to be light lines or blocks across the bottom. I don't think this is a pixel artifact effect, but I'm not positive, so I left them in.

Protected, MatthewV - if I've made any mistakes here, please let me know.
_________________
JJA
"Sancte," inquit, "quare, quaeso, rapis arborem festam?"

[Protected]

[tentative]

Here’s a thought: 3iff’s 2-lines-per-symbol theory may indicate a walk on the circles. Suppose we start at some circle and then repeatedly move from one circle to another. Then we count the number of times we’ve visited each circle and the number of times we’ve moved between each pair of circles.

The arrow-like line at the top may indicate that the top circle is our starting point. The missing line at the center circle may indicate that this is where we finish.

The 2 missing lines at the top circle don’t quite fit in. Maybe it means that one of the visits should be counted as two. Maybe there were actually two walks, with one of them starting at the top and ending at the center, and the other starting and ending at the top circle.

[Protected]

... Two hints, because Matthew is impatient :

* Up until now you're going well, tentative's post is important.

* The shape of the symbols, the relationship between them and the differences of color are more important than the colors themselves or the overal positions.

[MatthewV]

[3iff]

MatthewV, the hints don't really help (me) so don't worry.

Anyway, another thought, probably equally wrong...

Those lines always suggested to me chemical bonds. If the shapes are important, then hexagons are common in organic chemistry, specifically when involving RNA and DNA...these create life as we know it.

quote: "Adenine is a purine. Purines are six-membered rings attached to five membered rings."

Here we have three 6 membered rings (in the shape of hexagons) and some are 'attached' to a 5 membered ring.

As I've said, I may be way off here, and I can't make sense of most of it, especially the 3 member ring or the general colour differences...any ideas?

[Tony Gardner]

there are exactly 26 outer symbols. alphabet? don't see how thought yet


edit --- oops, that was already suggested by foggy in post 4

[3iff]

I tried the alphabet idea. Various ways of applying it using the 4 'different' symbols I could see revealed no word or name.

Even with the additional 2 different symbols as shown in the re-drawn diagram (by jja) nothing makes itself apparent.

Apparently Tentative's post is getting us closer, but if it's the walks from circle to circle, then there are too many possible paths to take.

...getting nowhere fast...

[Ctorj]

I like tentative's idea via the hints. It is probably a set path that starts from somewhere and ends in the middle. Everytime a circle is visited, a symbol is "created" or "made" signifying some sort of event. Chronology seems important to me though I cannot say why.

But why all the jumping around? Perhaps it is the creation story of how God created all things in 6 days. (On the 7th he rested so no reason to have a cirlce about that.) Each circle represents the objects made on each day

Example: 1st day (green boxes) Maybe the 2 similar boxes represent when he created the heavens and the earth. The last box that has the different corners could represent the light and darkness that was also created on the first day. I can see how this fits.

By the way, I am thinking as I type in case you haven't noticed.

This is as far as I have gotten. Feel free to shoot me down though if I'm wrong.

[jja]

I've adjusted the PDF slightly to add more cyan to the small center circle, as Protected requested.

Keeping the poem in mind: I wonder if that circle is meant to symbolize a looking glass or something of similar effect...

Passing thought: 26 = Seasons of Doctor Who, at least until recently, but I was not able to find any further relevance.
_________________
JJA
"Sancte," inquit, "quare, quaeso, rapis arborem festam?"

[Ctorj]

Looking at the puzzle closer throws my God idea out. The first day with the green squares fits, but everything else does not fit. Never mind.
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"Love is the absolute expression of the human perfection" -Me!

Created by MyFitnessPal.com

[Foggy]

Okay, so how about Myst, which Protector hinted at by the colors being more appropriately Cyan.

I'm still working out how exactly, and which version.

[Ctorj]

Foggy: I tend to disagree with that because the hint said that the relationship of the colors being more important than the colors themselves.

At this point, we could really use some more hints. This one is definitley a toughie.
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"Love is the absolute expression of the human perfection" -Me!

Created by MyFitnessPal.com

[Protected]

Well, those two hints weren't too important. It's what I would have disguised in a flavortext, if I hadn't been too unimaginative to write one

I'll give you some more time before I give a hint ~_~

[Zytheran]

I have noticed that evidently Japanese anime typically has 26 episodes. Unfortunately I'm not very familiar with it. Could it be that the path following the red lines through each of the 26 symbols represents a series and the different symbols represent a type of episode, or main character influence? I'd say there are 6 different variables within the the 5 outer and 1 central circle. Within each of these is some variation. The first episode would be in the top circle, the last in the center one? The number of sides of the symbols is perhaps another variable and covers circle=1, D-shape = 2, triangle =3, square =4 and weird shape =8.

[Ctorj]

I think the bottom-right symbols look like elephants (2 w/ purple trunks?), but that's just me.
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"Love is the absolute expression of the human perfection" -Me!

Created by MyFitnessPal.com

[scribe]

I also like the traversal idea - assuming that one symbol gets added on arrival at a circle, this would give 7 symbols in the middle, too. The fact that there are only 13 links to the middle also definitely suggests it's the ending point. However, it still doesn't explain the one extra symbol in the top-most circle - unless we add *2* symbols on entering it for the first time.

I assume the arrangement of the symbols within each circle is also non-random. As each circle has a symbol at the top, it might make sense to assume that each symbol that gets added, gets added in a clockwise order. I think, then, the differences in symbols may reveal something to do with the traversal order - e.g. where to go next, or where we've just come from. They might not, of course

However, as there don't seem to be any differences in symbols for the top-right circle, I'm not sure how that fits in yet.

Also, there are at least 7 "different" symbols, as there are 3 in the middle too. In the top-most circle, it *looks* like the top-left and -right pyramids have different colour dots along their base, so they could possibly be considered "different" too.

The other thing that stikes me is the first quoted line of the poem. "...present and past" might indicate some kind of "era" thing - maybe each circle represents a different period of time, with something moving backards and forwards between them?

[Ctorj]

Scribe has had the same thought I have had though it is still too abstract to define what is going on. I'm going to be really mad if it turns out to be the travels of "Where in Time is Carmen San Diego?" That would be just messed up.
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"Love is the absolute expression of the human perfection" -Me!

Created by MyFitnessPal.com

[Guest]

I come here all the time to see the puzzles (even though I can't solve them) and this one seems exceptionally hard. After reading the last post, the movie Time Bandits popped into my head.

I haven't seen it in a long time, but from what I remember, some of it seems like it could fit.

[Logain]

Just taking a look at this for the first time. With the hint of past and present in the poem, I would tend to think of the red lines as time travel.

Maybe the 5 outer circles represent periods in the past while the center is the present. So some travels return to the present and go back out while others jump right across time lines.

Instantly I think of it representing a TV show like Quantum Leap, but I can't piece together how that would fit. One odd bit of info I looked up is that the series Doctor Who had 26 seasons which coincides with the number of objects in the 5 outer rings.

[Zytheran]

With regards to Doctor Who. Perhaps the largre circles represent each Doctor and the symbols within represent his companions in each of the series? Or the major enemies he faces? Anyone familiar with Doctor Who?

[3iff]

Dr Who has had 9 doctors (with the 10th just making his appearance)...and a host of baddies and companions.

Other than someone saying there have been 26 series, I cannot see any Dr Who links in this puzzle.

[Dred Pirate Westley]

I'm also a visitor to this site regularly, and it IS rare for me to solve a puzzle simply because I usually go at it alone. However, with this one, I am very intreagued and decided to check out the forum. Here's my input (whether it's helpful or not.)

The title must be important. "The Creator". I like the idea that maybe is has something to do with the creation process described in Genesis 1. However, I also note the color of the red lines (or paths) in the puzzle. There is something that bible scholars call the "Scarlet Thread" in the bible that describes foreshadowing symbols of the coming of Christ. I don't know IF or HOW this may fit, but I'd like to throw it out there to see if anyone has any deeper thoughts.

Lastly, there are 5 outer circles ... could this refer to the first five books of the bible, known as the Pentatuch? Maybe I've raised more questions than answers. But again, I think the title must be very important.